TOS Regional Recreational Forum - 22 November 2007

Open Meeting & Apologies

Meeting chair, Rob Tinkler (MFish), opened the meeting and welcomed attendees.

Attendees

Ron Adams

Martyn Barlow

Charlie Boulton

John Duncan

Greg Goodall

Ron Prestage

Betty McNab

Mark Roden

John Waugh

John Williams

MFish staff:

Rob Tinkler

Claire Norris

Scott Williamson

Geoff Clark

Agenda conformation

Rob confirmed the agenda and order of agenda items.

Correspond.

Martyn Barlow explained to the forum about the letter he sent (on behalf of TASFISH) to Carol Scott of the Challenger Finfish Management Company, about voluntary no trawl areas in Tasman Bay, and the lack of compliance with this voluntary agreement. He put forward his perspective that voluntary agreements do not work, and such rules should be put into regulation. MFish noted this, and suggested the best opportunity to progress this issue is through the Challenger Inshore Finfish Plan.

Meeting notes of the previous meeting

Members confirmed notes from previous meeting.

Betty asked for an amendment to be made to page 2 - remove “possible” from “possible localised depletion” in the FLA 7 notes.  Amendment agreed.

Action: Rob to amend the minutes from the last meeting as requested.

Members regional updates

Members provided an update on recreational fishing in their local areas, and submitted fishing reports.

Compliance Update-MFish

MFish District Compliance Manager, Geoff Clark, updated forum members on compliance issues within the ToS.  

Geoff noted that DOC has been finding lots of fishers going into the two marine reserves (most likely visitors to the region). 

Access to paua in Port Underwood: Geoff explained he had talked to Dave Baker about commercial fishers seeking shelter in Port Underwood when the weather was too bad to fish elsewhere, resulting in recreational fishers struggling to take their daily bag limit. Geoff got agreement from Dave to look at voluntarily raising the minimum legal size of the fish they harvest to 127mm. Ron Adams noted that fishers don’t often have trouble filling their bag limit for paua in Port Underwood, but supported an initiative for commercial fishers to voluntarily raise their minimum legal size. 

Set netting in the Marlborough Sounds: Compliance met with the new commercial set netter and spent time with him going through the fishing regulations and observing him. Geoff noted he seems to be fishing legally. 

Geoff noted there has been an increase in danish seining (instead of trawling). Scott noted that he had been approached by a couple of commercial fishers  asking that the method be allowed within 3 nautical miles of the coast. 

John Duncan raised the issue of hook size for blue cod, noting that Soundfish had received funding to recommend this.  John would like to see a joint effort between Soundfish and MFish to produce big displays on hook size (like the didymo signs seen in Golden Bay), and have signs at boat ramps.  Geoff said this was a possibility.  

Geoff reiterated his invitation for suggestions from the forum on what items they would like him to discuss in future meetings. 

Report back on National Meeting on Recreational Forums

Greg Goodall and John Waugh attended the National Meeting of Regional Recreational Forums on the 20^th and 21^st of November, in Wellington. They reported back to the forum on each of the agenda items.  

It is likely another national meeting will be held in 2008. Greg and John suggested another two people should go, as they learned a lot.  

Greg and John acknowledged the work Leigh Mitchell and Andy Warmbrum put into organising the meeting, and their genuine interest in making it a successful meeting. They noted how astounded they were at the number and quality of MFish staff included in the agenda.   

Scott asked Greg and John whether they noticed any common interests or similarities between the TOS forum and other forums.  Greg suggested that if an one page overview was prepared for each forum meeting around the country, and posted on the MFish website, members could easily see what other forums are discussing (without having to trawl through all the minutes).  

Ron Adams thanked Greg and John for attending the national meeting on behalf of the TOS forum, noting they gave a good presentation at short notice! 

Action: Scott to pass on this acknowledgement to Leigh and Andy.

Action: Formal meeting notes to be distributed to forum, once received.

FLA 7

As promised, MFish reported back on the FLA 7 localised depletion issues.  Scott gave a short presentation on FLA 7, of which they key points were: 

• TACC has never been reviewed.
• Commercial harvest of FLA 7 has never got close to the TACC of 2066t (the closest was approximately 1500t).
• Between 1 – 4% of FLA 7 commercial catch has been taken from stat area 017 which encompasses the Marlborough Sounds and Cloudy and Clifford Bays.
• The rolling average of commercial catch taken from stat area 017 is approximately 32t. 

Scott then suggested some options for resolving the issue. Some of the possible options that were discussed included:

• Reduce the FLA 7 TAC to bring it in line with current catch levels would not constrain catch or fix local depletion. The earliest possible implementation of any TAC changes would be October 2008
• Increasing the deemed value for FLA 7. This was rejected as there is a lot of uncaught ACE already, and it could create dumping problems (especially as they are not high value fish).
• Close areas to commercial fishing (by regulation). It was noted that this option would be slow and expensive, and that you couldn’t close every bay.
• Voluntary measures and agreements 

John Duncan suggested that MFish exercises to estimate the recreational catch were both costly and unnecessary, since the real issue was the level of harvestable fish.    In other words, CPUE, size distribution and return rates are more useful than calculating the level of depletion or the number of recreational fishers.  Martyn suggested investigating whether aspects of the Inner Pelorus Sound Flounder Code of Practice could be regulated.  

The forum agreed to support a three fold approach: 

(1)    Make localised depletion of flatfish in the Marlborough Sounds a key issue for the Challenger Inshore Finfish Plan (longer term).

(2)    Scott will suggest the FLA 7 TAC (and allocations) is reviewed subject to Ministry prioritisation (medium term).

(3)    MFish facilitate a review of the Inner Pelorus Sound Flounder Code of Practice with Carol Scott and a sub-group of the TOS forum, made up of Des Boyce, Betty, Martyn, John Duncan and Johnny Williams (shorter term).  

Geoff Clark noted that the new commercial set netter in the Marlborough Sounds was unaware of the Code of Practice. The chain of informing fishers is Carol Scott to quota owners to ACE fishers. Betty noted she wasn’t so worried about the new fishers, but about those that continually contravene the Code of Practice. Martyn asked whether the Code of Practice could be put into regulation. Scott said that some parts could be suitable for regulation, but others weren’t, and that if the forum supported regulating aspects of it, he would prefer this was progressed through the fish plan (as regulation is a long process anyway).  

John Duncan raised the potential of using a vessel monitoring system (VMS), as used by commercial scallop fishers. Scott said it would be possible to implement something like this through gazettal, but that MFish had already started work on fine-scale reporting (lats and longs).  

Martyn questioned the possibility of having fine scale sub-TACCs. Scott said it was possible, but had never been done. 

Action: MFish to put a review of FLA 7 TAC on the prioritisation list for the next MFish sustainability round.

Action: Rob to make contact with Carol to organise a meeting to review the Code of Practice.

Hectors Threat Management Plan

 Rob gave the forum a brief update on the Hectors and Maui Threat Management Plan. He noted the huge number of submissions that were received (2,500). He noted that four options were provided to the Minister, who was expected to make a decision by Xmas. 

Betty noted the position of the Marlborough Recreational Fishers Association, who support the status quo until more information has been gathered.

Top of the South Island Fisheries Research

Claire gave the forum a brief presentation of recent research findings, including:

• Results from the 2007 West Coast South Island trawl survey;
• A taste of the preliminary findings of the Characterisation of Recreational Fishing in the Marlborough Sounds; and
• A summary of the final report of the West Coast South Island Recreational Survey.  

Claire explained that there was a lot more information in the reports than what she had touched on, and forum members should let her know if they wanted to see more.  

Action: Claire to send Charlie a copy of the final report of the West Coast recreational research findings. Sent 26 November.

Telson Clipping

 Martyn talked briefly of the benefits he saw in telson clipping of rock lobster, and asked forum members for their perspective, with a view to promoting it as issue for the next recreational regulations review.  

Scott noted some of the pros and cons of telson clipping:

• Australia has very different catch recording and tracking systems
• It is not a silver bullet – will not stop poaching, but would be a tool for compliance
• Is not universally supported by recreational fishers
• The Minister has rejected it once 

Geoff Clark explained that poaching is a big problem, and that there is a particular problem in the restaurant trade.  If the rock lobster get through the door, they become difficult to trace, which is why there was an idea of commercial rock lobster fishers using tags.  

Scott noted that a lot of money would need to be spent on educating the public if telson clipping was introduced. Martyn suggested a one year amnesty, or something similar.

Recreational Regulations Review

Claire briefly mentioned the upcoming third, and final, review of recreational regulations. This is part of the promise made by the Minister to review the top 10 concerns of recreational fishers over a 3 year period. Claire will be running the review, which is done in conjunction with the NZRFC, starting in early 2008. 

Claire asked forum members to start thinking of proposals they might have for this review, and to bring them along to the next forum meeting where they could be discussed with the rest of the forum, before being submitted for consideration by the NZRFC.  She noted proposals can be directly submitted to Keith Ingram at the NZRFC, or through MFish who will pass them on to Keith.  

Action: Forum members to come prepared to the next forum meeting with ideas for the next recreational regulations review.

Shared Fisheries Update

Scott gave the forum a quick update on the recent announcements from the Minister that have so far resulted from the Shared Fisheries proposals.

Fish Plans Update

Claire gave the forum an update on the Challenger Inshore Finfish Fisheries (CIFF) plan and the advisory group. She noted the first meeting of the advisory group has been confirmed for December 12th. Claire showed forum members the draft agenda, the list of confirmed members of the advisory group, and took them through the CIFF plan webpage (http://fpcs.fish.govt.nz/FishPlanComplex.aspx?ID=11). She noted that all fish plan meeting agendas, minutes and documents would be available on the website. 

Claire also asked the forum how they wanted to manage the liaison role of the representatives on the advisory group, suggesting the possibility of a working group.  She noted there would be two to three fish plan meetings between each TOS forum meeting.  Forum members were happy for the representatives to keep the forum up to date through an informal structure of emailing and ringing around. 

Claire suggested the forum review this arrangement at each forum meeting, to ensure it is working, and everyone is satisfied with the liaising. She also asked the forum to let her know at any stage if they needed any resources or help to make liaising back and forth easier. 

Keeping the three substitute members up to date was also noted as being important, so they could easily slot in if they needed to fill in for someone at a fish plan meeting. Claire agreed to provide substitute members with folders and with any documents that come out of meetings, and representatives agreed to keep the substitute members up to date.

Review of Forum arrangements

 As a follow up to some of the issues raised at the National Meeting of recreational forums on how the forums are run, the forum discussed and agreed to the following: 

• The forum gave MFish the go ahead to invite someone from the new Buller recreational group to join the forum;
• Have 5 meetings a year (instead of 4), with the aim of having a meeting every 10 weeks (with the possibility of having the meetings more regularly in winter, and less in summer);
• If there is a really important issue, an extra meeting could be organised (the forum would need to signal this to MFish);
• Rob to provide a draft meeting schedule for 2008, and at each meeting the following 2 meeting dates will be confirmed;
• Rob and Claire to provide a media report and a 1 page summary of the meeting (for forum members’ use) within 2-3 working days of meetings;
• Draft meeting minutes to be completed within 10 working days;
• Possibility of having meetings on Saturdays (and have a longer meeting), or in other locations (Blenheim, Havelock). The onus is on forum members to let MFish know if they want a change to the current arrangements.  

Martyn noted the forum needs to take responsibility for putting up their own agenda items.  

Action: Rob to email a draft 2008 meeting schedule to the forum. The forum will confirm the date for the next meeting by email/phone, and will confirm future dates at following meetings.

Action: Rob to confirm a new member from the Buller recreational fishing group.

Agenda items for the next meeting

The following is a list of agenda items raised during the meeting for the next forum meeting: 

Marine Protected Areas progress update 

Update on Charter boat group – Dave Scranney from CIT?? 

Invite Ralph Townsend (MFish Chief Economist) to a meeting next year to talk about the value of recreational fishing. 

Fish Plans Update 

Discussion of possible proposals for next recreational regulations review